Human Beings As Your Stair Case Upwards

[lawrencegabriel]

God has a structure that works with the PRINCIPLE OF SOWING AND REAPING.What you pour out will come back to you in increased measure,pressed down,shaking together and running over. When you give generously, an abundant generous harvest will return to you. When you help others succeed, you will find abundant success on your path, too. What are your investment in the lives of the people around you? Are you helping others get ahead? There are people in your life who hold the keys for you to reach your full potential. These are the people who serve as your stair cases and God has placed them in your life within your reach,for you to help along and also get helped to your own world. The higher they rise up, the highest you will rise up. When you give generously of your time, talent, and resources, you are setting yourself up for greater success. People will come across your path that will help you grow and reach your full potential. But you have to do your part to step out and sow the seed.
Be on the lookout for ways you can help others. As you give of yourself to help others grow, you’ll rise higher and live the abundant life He has in store for you.

[DrRita]

i moved your thread. Please take the time to read the TOS and FAQs.

[lynnmosher]

Very good thoughts, lawrence. It is only in pouring out that we receive refilling, in any area of life.

[Ransom v. Unman]

Interesting that Jesus encourages people to give to those who cannot give back, and to bless those who will not be able to aid you or help you in any way...

If you give with a heart towards getting back, well, that's not exactly charity, is it? More like investing.

[lynnmosher]

Glad you're back, Ransom. And that was a very good thought. I'd never thought of it that way. Glad you said that. Thanks!

[ProfessorAlan]

I don't consider the goal of a relationship with Christ to be either "setting yourself up for greater success" or to "reach your full potential." These concepts brush a little too close to "The Celestine Prophecy" for my comfort.

[lynnmosher]

Ummm, Prof...I'm a little confused about "reach your full potential." I'm not being contrary here, just need some clarification. If we do not have Christ in our lives, or if we have accepted Him but do not live for Him, are we then not living to the full potential or expectation that God has for us? Please elucidate this ol' brain!

[ProfessorAlan]

"Potential" is a New Age buzzword, so perhaps I was reading to much into it, but the serendipitous notion of people who "will come across your path that will help you grow" is both a key plot element of and a major "lesson" of "Celestine Prophecy."

[lynnmosher]

Gotcha! Thanks! Now for another stupid question...what is "Celestine Prophecy"? I haven't heard of that.

[kshsj777]

Me neither.

[ProfessorAlan]

Best-selling, New Age novel from 10 years (or so) ago -- guy goes on vision quest to discover the "9 Insights" of life, which are a mix of Buddhism and various other religious and non-religious systems.

[lynnmosher]

Aha! Thanks, Prof, for the explanation. Now I understand.

[lawi]

I don't consider the goal of a relationship with Christ to be either "setting yourself up for greater success" or to "reach your full potential." These concepts brush a little too close to "The Celestine Prophecy" for my comfort.

yep..i have been wondering weather the prophets and saints like the early church talked bout full potential thing.... there is some truth in your words n-way..i dont mean we should not try ourbest in all we do coz that how we will challeng and be able to reach to many pple and influence..but i am not sure bout that ..i have been pondering

[lawrencegabriel]

I Am Astonished That The Scripture That Says Give And It Shall Be Given Unto You Good Measure Press Down Shaking Together And Runnig Over Shall Men Had Unto Your Bossom(luke 6 Vs 38)...had Been Totally Wattered Low By Even We Believers Who Should Be An Advocate Of Giving.
I Remembered A Story Jesus Told His Disciples On How When He Was In Prison,how He Was Sick Nobody Nursed Him,he Was Naked And Nobody Clothed Him And The Disciples Asked When Did All These Things Happen Considering That They Have Always Being With Him...he Only Said If You Do It To The Least Of My Brethren You Have Practically Done It Unto Me.
No Man Does Somthing For God And He Does Not Repay.he Does Not Owe Debt At All And He Is Faithful Concerning His Promises.
Tell Me ..if You Win A Man Like Barrack Obama To Christ And He Eventually Becomes The President Will He Not Perhaps Make You His Spiritual Father Adn Guidance When He Needs A Sound Counsel.remnber That There Is Always A Gold Coin In The Fish Around You.
Love

[Ransom v. Unman]

Let me be clear... We're not coming against the idea of giving, but what I find dangerous and perhaps a little distasteful is the idea that we should give just so we can get back in the future. Christ called us to live lives of radical charity so that when we gave we would expect nothing back.

The honest truth is, there are lots of people who give everything and don't get anything back from it. Jesus says we should store treasures in the Kingdom, that is, we should not look to earthly riches for fulfillment at all. If we give money away just to be recognised, or to get rich at some point down the road, well, Jesus says that we already have our reward, and that it will do us no good.

The bottom line is that Jesus' commands are not the spiritual equivalent of a get-rich-quick scheme, nor are they investment guidelines. They are words that bring life and which, in order to be Kingdom people, we must obey.

People are not our "staircase", they are other fallen creatures made in God's image. Our charity towards them should have as few (if any!) ulterior motives as possible.

[lynnmosher]

Right on, Ransom! I wholeheartedly agree. Therefore, let me clarify what I said in the beginning...

It is only in pouring out that we receive refilling, in any area of life.

We give out of a heart of love and obedience, with no thought of a return. We don't give to get. Whether we give of help, time, money, or whatever, we will receive something, maybe not in like kind, but something, for if scripture says give and you will receive, then we will, whether here on earth or later in heaven. The specific kind of refilling is up to the Lord. Usually, it is as simple as receiving joy from giving. And joy is enough for me. If the Lord decides to add on top of that, then praise the Lord!

I have a headache and not thinking clearly. I don't know if that came out right. Did it make sense?

[ProfessorAlan]

People are not our "staircase", they are other fallen creatures made in God's image.

Yes .... it's whenever we serve one of the least of these, we serve Christ. That's our motivation; we don't serve to reach some "full potential."

[Lookin^Up]

The closest thing we as Christians have to a "full potential"--and I use that term loosely--is a promise of Heaven when we're finished with our mortal lives. Some do apply themselves and succeed in reaching great heights, even above most of his peers, but this is only on a material scale. The more important spiritual potential is all that God cares about. May we all place our trust in Him.

[Xenia]

I also think God judges our motives.. if we are giving to get then our intentions are all wrong! I am very leery of anything that sounds WOF minded as this does.
The Bible says that there was no greater prophet than John the Baptist yet for all his "giving" of himself it cost him his head!
Our treasures await us in heaven :).

[Ransom v. Unman]

Some do apply themselves and succeed in reaching great heights, even above most of his peers, but this is only on a material scale. The more important spiritual potential is all that God cares about.
Hmm... I'm going to have to differ with you here slightly. Mostly a matter of semantics, but if church history has shown us anything, it's that semantics are very important.

What we do in the material effects the spiritual, and vice versa. God cares a great deal about both, and neglecting one for the other does not spread the Kingdom. Charity is one of those ways that we bring both the physical world and our own hearts into alignment with God's will.

I see what you're saying, that if we practise charity in the physical with only the hopes of reaping a physical reward then we are not in line with Kingdom, and I agree with that. But I guess I'd admonish you to use less dualistic terminology, lest we encourage the next Elaine Pagels or Marcion... :)

[lynnmosher]

Sometimes, Ransom, you confuse the heck out of this ol' brain. (Ha! Maybe there's too much heck in there! LOL) However, it is very welcomed, for it forces me to do a search of what you are saying, which I just did, or to ask questions. Because you are so well read, it just oozes out of your head! And I, for one, am grateful! I may not always like your style, but I always appreciate your knowledge. !thumbsup!

[ProfessorAlan]

The gnostic movement was/is all about the dual nature of all things: the material being bad, and the spiritual being good. I agree with RvU's concern about a focus on the otherworldly to the detriment of our focus on the material.

As a matter of fact, Jesus' basis of judgment at the final judgment seems to be distinctly on our material care of others: feeding, clothing and visiting the least of these His children.

[Lookin^Up]

What we do in the material effects the spiritual, and vice versa. God cares a great deal about both, and neglecting one for the other does not spread the Kingdom. Charity is one of those ways that we bring both the physical world and our own hearts into alignment with God's will.

I see what you're saying, that if we practise charity in the physical with only the hopes of reaping a physical reward then we are not in line with Kingdom, and I agree with that.
I did not intend to sound dualistic. You have merely refined the point I was trying to make. By "material" I was talking about our focus being on making lots of money, buying a large house, getting a chauffeured limousine, wearing the latest and greatest fashions, and taking many trips to foreign countries. Nothing is wrong in any of this, so long as it's God's will for our lives. I was speaking of such a lifestyle being our choice over God's.

As a matter of fact, Jesus' basis of judgment at the final judgment seems to be distinctly on our material care of others: feeding, clothing and visiting the least of these His children.
You're right, Prof, our service must be in the material realm for others rather than for ourselves. Seems to me we're all agreed on this point, we just used different words to express it.

[writegirl1949]

This is a great discussion and I agree with RvU, Prof, and Lookin^up (always gotta search for that ^ key, lol).

In my simple understanding, we give because, as the Holy Spirit lives in us, we become more obedient to Jesus' two greatest commandments (again in simple terms)

Love God
Love Others

Those two commands have nothing to do with "receiving."

I'll go entirely "off topic" by saying, following the Beatitudes reinforces the idea of we are to live.

Blessings, Francine

[Lookin^Up]

This is a great discussion and I agree with RvU, Prof, and Lookin^up (always gotta search for that ^ key, lol).
Think "higher than 6," the number of a man.