Is POD a waste of time and money?

[Raine]

I do not follow the POD strategy. I realize that it is a way to get your work published, but it seems to me that it fails on every level.

From a business standpoint, YOU pay to have YOUR work published. There may be a few, and I would bet very few, who ever recapture their initial investment. Let alone any return on the investment, after you take out time and effort for your labor.

Second, it would seem to me that MOST (not all...) of the self published books available on the market are POD for a reason; poor writing.

I don't want to sound mean, but the road to hell was paved with good intentions. It may make sense to POD a small run of church books or for an inner office event, but it can never make sense from a business standpoint.

Am I crazy, or did I miss something?

[tlm]

If you have a forum or a following for some reason, I believe that POD could work for you. For example, a preacher, especially a revival preacher might do well with a table of his books set up at the front door.

A motivational speaker might do well also. If you aren't someone with a following, for whatever reason, you won't do as well.

[Gravity]

Toni's right. For non-fiction, if your platform is big enough, you can make money going the self-pub/vanity/subsidy route. But there are a lot of landmines, not the least of which is pricing each unit in such a way that it moves briskly, but still makes you some coin. Not an easy job, that. Plus you have to be a crackerjack salesman (or woman).

For fiction, the equation is a lot more stark. POD=KOD. Kiss of death. Why? With no speaking platform, no one will know your books exist. Ergo, while you'll have no problem selling the first batch of your novel to your friends and family (face it, you know they'll buy), after that, the curve drops off the map.

[tlm]

The only way I made ANY money with my book (and it wasn't much) was that I lived near a large city where I got coverage with a couple of local TV AM talk shows, about 1/2 a dozen newspapers, several bookstores invited me to do signings (if I supplied my own books) and people who liked the book bought 2nd copies as gifts. Even with that the bookstores and PA made way--way more money than I did.

The positive is that it was a learning experience and I did enjoy the attention. (yes, I'm blushing)

[jacks girl]

Can any of you give me an example of what it cost do print your own books. like a hundred books cost you XX amount of money.

I don't mean to hi jack your thread. My question kind of goes along with the theme of the thread. Raine if you mind PM me I will remove this and start my own thread.

jacks Girl

[tlm]

That all depends on who you go with. Some POD will not charge an up-front fee, but you have to know how to edit and set up the type etc.

[Raine]

Try this web page for getting specific quotes on the cost of printing your own book. I think they are in Wyoming, but not sure. I have used them for post cards, and they come well respected in the printing business.


www.printforless.com

Raine

[jvdoles]

Pod (Print On Demand) is a printing technology. Not the same as POD vanity publishers who are the same old vanity publishers as before, but who make use of the new printing technology.

[Raymond Creed]

The best POD seems to be Lulu who do have good customer service and don't charge up front. Since going on last April I have found it to be very helpful in: -
1) Providing insight into the Publishing process
2) Obtaining feedback
3) Establishing professional credibility
However, my experience of Lulu is as a non-fiction writer. My plan is to use it as a platform from which to market my wares to the conventional publishing area. With regard to Lulu I would say 'so far so good' with regards to highly specialized material. However, some of the Fiction Writers are no hoppers who are living in rather than writing fantasy. One I came across seemed to be mentally ill. He gave me a lot of abuse on my discussion thread before being removed.

Hope you find this feedback to be of use.

Raymond creed

[philo]

POD is part of my marketing strategy because of the length of time involved in the traditional publishing process. It gets me feedback and will allow me to see what kind of "legs" the book has--can it stand on its own. Before anyone looks down their noses at self-published work, they ought to keep in mind that a lot of books that wound up on the best seller lists started out as self-published. And traditional publishers don't have a flawless record at judging work. Ask the two-dozen or so who turned down Harry Potter. Google for plenty of examples.

[50/50 Adventure]

Thanks for the info guys . . . . . I will be looking into this in June/July.

I wonder if they gives multiple discounts ? ? ? ?

[Gravity]

Self-pubbing can work for certain types of non-fiction. If the unit price is kept low enough to turn a buck or three, and the platform is large enough to support back-of-the-room sales, many people have made some nice coin going the self-pub route.

Self-pubbing doesn't work well for fiction; in point of fact, POD=KOD (kiss of death) for novels, because after the author has sold a book to each of his friends and family, the market is pretty much tapped out. The average title sells around seventy-five copies, hardly what the writer had in mind when he or she spent hundreds of hours penning the thing.

I wish we had a sticky for this...

[philo]

Here are some of those "unworthy" books that were rejected by agents & publishers and self-published:
What Color is Your Parachute?
In Search of Excellence
The Celestine Prophecy
The One-Minute Manager
The Elements of Style
The Joy of Cooking
Embraced by the Light
Feed Me, I'm Yours
Roberts Rules of Order

23 publishers rejected Dr. Seuss. 22 rejected M*A*S*H. 16 rejected The Peter Principle. 18 rejected Jonathan Livingston Seagull. 33 rejected Chicken Soup for the Soul. 121 turned down Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. 30 rejected Carrie. 38 rejected Gone with the Wind. 16 rejected The Diary of Anne Frank.
Dubliners, a collection of short stories by James Joyce, was rejected 22 times. The publisher who did accept it only printed 1250 copies. It sold all of 379 the first year, 120 of them to Joyce himself. It is still among the most popular titles of one of the most influential writers of the 20th century.

A Confederacy of Dunces, rejected so many times the writer kiled himself, won the Pultizer Prize.
A Wrinkle in Time, rejected 26 times, won the Newberry Medal in 1963, is currently in its 69th printing.

Cream does, indeed, rise to the top. In publishing, it just may take some time to get there and follow a path that isn't all that traditional.

[Gravity]

Okay, I'll zip in, say this, and then zip back out. No one is saying self-pubbed or vanity books aren't "worthy"; all I'm saying is that by going the self-pubbed or vanity route, a writer has made the job of getting his or her work widely read on a national scale harder. A whale of a lot harder than it needs to be.

Is it tough to go the commercial publishing route? Without a doubt; the highway to the bookstore is long, hard and steep. But take it from someone who's done it both ways. Unwittingly going with a vanity house for my first novel (PublishAmerica, although back in '01 no one had ever heard of them, and they're very slick at what they do, so they fooled me), and the next three novels repped by a top agent and published by a solid, mid-sized commercial CBA house.

It's like night and day.

The difference between a commercial house caring if your work gains a lot of readers (and let's be frank, making everybody concerned some coin), and a vanity house mainly being concerned whether or not the author's check clears, is stark. Believe it or not.

But since I have the feeling my words are falling on deaf ears, I'll say so long, and wish you all God's richest blessings.

[philo]

But since I have the feeling my words are falling on deaf ears, I'll say so long, and wish you all God's richest blessings.

I don't believe your words are falling on deaf ears, at least from my standpoint. I hear what you're saying. I don't think you're hearing what I'm saying--or perhaps I'm not explaining it well enough.

This does not have to be an either/or situation. Look at it from a both/and viewpoint. Self-publishing/POD, et al can be a step along the path to traditional publishing. As has been shown in a variety of ways in my previous post. The ideal situation is a great agent and receptive publishers. It doesn't always work that way right out of the chute. And because it doesn't always work that way and because the judgment of both agents and publishers is not infallible, I don't think all other doors should be closed.

Having said that, I must admit a personal bias against spending thousands of dollars on an untested, unedited manuscript as some sort of ego gratification. But if it's part of an intentional marketing plan, who knows?

I believe you are truly concerned about people spending money foolishly or having unrealistic expectations. Just don't paint everyone with the same broad brush. That's as unfair as saying all agents and publishers are alike and don't care about new writers.

[Raymond Creed]

Maybe I can strike a middle way between the previous two contributors by saying that if you do go into self-publication you must know exactly what you're doing. It is not an enterprise for vague minded amateurs. In particular, you need to have very clear aims and it also helps if you have the business talents of a Bill Gates - for in effect you are setting up your own business. As a Christian, I would also add that you need to have a definite call from God to go down that direction otherwise the only result is heartbreak. My advice is to pray and ask for wisdom before following it, (James 1:5). I myself have had to do a lot of this recently.